How much water is too much inside Hobie AI ???

The front hatch on the Hobie Islands is notorious for leaking. There are at least 3 approaches that people use to try to reduce the leakage, and I thought I had it figured out. However, this year I've been out several times sailing hard in rough conditions, and have ended up with a lot more water inside the hull than I recall having in the past. Previously, I'd only have a couple of cups of water, but this year, it seems more like a couple of quarts.

It's not a huge amount of water, so I don't think it is a serious leak (I did put a few inches of water in the hull to check for a leak and nothing showed up). The most likely suspect remains the front hatch, but there are other possibilities (round hatches, for example).

Anyways, I'm wondering how much water people get inside the hull when sailing their AI/TI in challenging conditions.

On windy days at oyster point I get a few quartz as well.  Front hatch leaks the most, from the two ridges.  I am about to put the foam mat underneath the hatch lid.  There is a video on youtube using a 16 inch inner bicycle tube around base of the hatch.  Have not try it but looks like a reasonable alternative.

On windy days at oyster point I get a few quartz as well.  Front hatch leaks the most, from the two ridges.  I am about to put the foam mat underneath the hatch lid.  There is a video on youtube using a 16 inch inner bicycle tube around base of the hatch.  Have not try it but looks like a reasonable alternative.

Thanks. I actually use something kinda like that inner tube trick, specifically, a squishy 3/4 inch diameter loop of silicone rubber tubing. On my yellow AI, that seems to be sufficient, but on my red AI (yes, I have 2 AIs...), it may not be enough. The inner tube might just be the ticket.

I had at least a couple gallons a couple weekends ago when I was having fun sailing in SC.  I have always run my FF wires under the hatch and I know it's not optimal.  But I will say that when I don't have the wires in, and I after I had just replaced my inner ring seal (that had come off on its own) with that split insulation for pipes that has a sticky edge.  At least the first few times I put the hatch back on you could actually feel it suction into place, like it forced air out as I put it on.  https://www.norcalkayakanglers.com/index.php?topic=97967.msg1103714#msg1103714

I noticed a lot of water coming through the rudder line holes. In roughish water and at speeds greater than 5mph, the stern of my AI will sometimes take a dip under the surface. Note: I am stern-heavy since I am motorized.

I noticed a lot of water coming through the rudder line holes. In roughish water and at speeds greater than 5mph, the stern of my AI will sometimes take a dip under the surface. Note: I am stern-heavy since I am motorized.

Do you think it's the rudder line holes or possibly the rear round hatch? In my case, I use larger diameter rudder lines and can't believe that a lot of water gets through those holes. But, both of the round hatches could be an issue.

Bought a Bell 16 inch tire.  I cannot fit it properly, its too small, keeps rollings out.  I am trying to stretch the tire over night and will try it again. 

I know zilch about the Hobie hatches, but wonder if the KZ “Frog Butt Seal” or an updated version might work for this. The thread and posts are very old, do the pics have dropped off, but it may offer some ideas?

https://www.norcalkayakanglers.com/index.php?topic=5204.msg42513#msg42513

I noticed a lot of water coming through the rudder line holes. In roughish water and at speeds greater than 5mph, the stern of my AI will sometimes take a dip under the surface. Note: I am stern-heavy since I am motorized.

Do you think it's the rudder line holes or possibly the rear round hatch? In my case, I use larger diameter rudder lines and can't believe that a lot of water gets through those holes. But, both of the round hatches could be an issue.

I am pretty certain it is the rudder line holes in my case. I have not observed much water coming over the rear round hatch when moving at higher speeds.
The round hatches are tough to seal. I try to remember to lube the o-rings often and I keep a couple car wash sponges under my seat. Both seem to help a little, but I’ve become ok with finding a couple quarts of water in the hull after moving around in rougher conditions.

Another place to check is the round hatch at the stern and middle of the kayak. Along with the rudder lines and front hatch, these seem to be the main leak areas. For my kayak, I will at most get a few cups of water in rough conditions.

I used to get gallons of water before on calm days, but that turned out to be a crack where the mirage drive sits....

Good luck trying to find the source of the problem   

Another technique that people sometimes use is to put a "shower cap" over the front hatch--it's discussed a bit in this thread from the Hobie forum:

https://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=51145&sid=f2afbc3054b8c831b026e4a1db588ae1

I made such a "shower cap" out of thin neoprene, and I figured out how to get it to seal really well. However, I never tested it out, as I was convinced that my silicone tubing was doing the trick. Now that I'm having doubts, I'm going to use the shower cap approach, along with my silicone tube gasket, and see if it makes a difference. If no/little water gets in, I'll know it was the front hatch--otherwise I'll know to look elsewhere.

When I used to motor and sail my AI, the back side, where the back hatch is, is usually always have some water around it.  So, I estimated that I always have about close to two gallon of water in the hull at the end of a 8-12-hour day.  I know that at least its a gallon as I remember one day after I open the plug for awhile, I decided to put a gallon jug and it filled it.

Maybe the best way to find out for sure which section of the kayak the leak is coming from is to put temporary walls inside the kayak just behind the hatches and the rudder holes. That way if water come in it will stay in the divider it leaked from.  Does not have to be a full wall but enough to contain the water in the walled off area to find out. Just a thought.

Made a shower cap with Tyvek. Any plastic fabric will do. Tyvek is durable.   Works really well. Not a drop from the front hatch.  But then, it’s another piece of gear.

Another technique that people sometimes use is to put a "shower cap" over the front hatch--it's discussed a bit in this thread from the Hobie forum:

https://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=51145&sid=f2afbc3054b8c831b026e4a1db588ae1

I made such a "shower cap" out of thin neoprene, and I figured out how to get it to seal really well. However, I never tested it out, as I was convinced that my silicone tubing was doing the trick. Now that I'm having doubts, I'm going to use the shower cap approach, along with my silicone tube gasket, and see if it makes a difference. If no/little water gets in, I'll know it was the front hatch--otherwise I'll know to look elsewhere.

Made a shower cap with Tyvek. Any plastic fabric will do. Tyvek is durable.   Works really well. Not a drop from the front hatch.  But then, it’s another piece of gear.

Another technique that people sometimes use is to put a "shower cap" over the front hatch--it's discussed a bit in this thread from the Hobie forum:

https://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=51145&sid=f2afbc3054b8c831b026e4a1db588ae1

I made such a "shower cap" out of thin neoprene, and I figured out how to get it to seal really well. However, I never tested it out, as I was convinced that my silicone tubing was doing the trick. Now that I'm having doubts, I'm going to use the shower cap approach, along with my silicone tube gasket, and see if it makes a difference. If no/little water gets in, I'll know it was the front hatch--otherwise I'll know to look elsewhere.

I may have to make a shower cap for our Oasis kayak.  It always takes water. 

Paul